tv This Week With George Stephanopoulos ABC August 9, 2015 8:00am-9:01am PDT
>> announcer: starting right now on abc's "this week," show time, donald trump at the gop debate. was his first face-off with opponents a major game-changer? for the 2016 race? plus, trump's new troubles. disinvited from an important conservative event for slamming this news anchor. >> there was blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out of her wherever. >> he's responding here live. and who stepped out of trump's huge shadow? we go one-on-one with other gop contenders. can they steal back the spotlight? plus, end of an era. jon stewart bids farewell to the daily show, can anyone fill his shoes? >> announcer: from abc news, "this week" with george stephanopoulos begins now.
love him or not, donald trump dominating the race for president right now, drawing a record-shattering 24 million viewers to this week's first debate. drowning out of his rivals and now a brand new firestorm. fellow candidates calling trump out for his latest attack on megyn kelly. top gop strategists saying this will pop the bubble. those predictions have been proven wrong before. donald trump standing by live to take on his critics after this report from jon karl. >> reporter: has trump finally gone too far? the latest, this insult directed at fox news host and debate monitor megyn kelly. >> you could see there was blood coming out of her eyes. blood coming out of her wherever. >> reporter: for the conservative group red state it was enough to boot the candidate from their gathering saturday. >> i don't want my daughter in the room with donald trump. >> reporter: and from jeb bush. >> come on, give me break. i mean, do we want to win? mr. trump ought to apologize. >> reporter: trump later tweeted he meant to say nose. in a response to his
cancellation, trump's team called red state editor in chief a total loser. who has a history of supporting establishment losers. it's an honor to be uninvited. with trump at war with both fox news and a prominent consecutive groups, one of the big questions, is he really a republican? at thursday's debate, he drew jeers after he refused to rule out an independent run, and trump's liberal past is coming under fire, including support for a single-payer health care system and his coziness with the clintons. >> i didn't get a phone call from bill clinton before i jumped in the race. >> reporter: another question, will trump fade? some of his opponents are now turning up the heat. >> he's used to buying politicians. >> reporter: but trump is not turning down the bombast that laugeed him to the top of the polls. >> our leaders are stupid, our politicians are stupid.
>> reporter: finally, can anyone step out of trump's shadow? the two men flanking trump on the debate stage, jeb bush and scott walker did little to stand out. the two who may have helped themselves the most, senator marco rubio. >> how is hillary clinton going to lecture me living paycheck to paycheck. i was raised paycheck to paycheck. >> reporter: and ohio governor john kasich, an experienced optimistic alternative to trump. >> if people who want to tune them out, they're making a mistake, now he's got his solutions, some of us have other solutions. >> reporter: whatever happens with trump in the ring, more people are paying attention to this campaign than anyone could have guessed. >> thanks to jon karl for that. the man drawing all that attention, joining us now, donald trurp on the phone. good morning, mr. trump, thank you for joining us. you're hearing the rivals stepping up the rhetoric. jeb bush said you should apologize. carly fiorina had this tweet. mr. trump, there is no excuse. scott walker agrees. what's your response? >> i'll start off with jeb bush on women's health issues, just destroyed his relationship with women, what he said a couple of
days ago. if you really get down to the important stuff. what he said about women and women's health issues was ridiculous, and i'm the exact opposite. i have always had a great relationship with the women. the relationship has been amazing in terms of thousands of employees and top level employees. i was one of the first people in the construction industry to put women in charge of major construction projects. my relationship has been great. carly fiorina is having a lot of fun. she doesn't discuss the fact that her stint at hewlett-packard was a disaster. she then ran for the senate and nobody talks about that. she lost in a landslide. other than that, i wish her well. she's very nice person. >> so, no apologies to megyn kelly, you don't think you crossed the line there? >> no, not at all. i said -- look, she asked me a very nasty question -- i have nothing against megyn kelly -- but she asked me a very, very nasty question, and in the middle of her questioning, i brought up a statement rosie o'donnell and the entire place, it was the biggest combination of laughter and applause. the place went crazy.
it interrupted her question. it obviously shook her up a little bit but she was very angry. you could see it. i made the statement blood was pouring from her eyes and then i said, blood was pouring from wherever, and when i said it, i just wanted to get -- i didn't say anything. excuse me, george, i was referring to nose, ears, a very common statement, and only a deviant would think of what some people said. some people would said, only a deviant would think that. who would think that? >> i mean, it was widely seen as that. i mean -- >> no, they built that up, george, they built it up. like, only literally a sick person would think that. and the only reason i even stopped my thought -- i didn't say even anything. i stopped. because i wanted to get on to the next subject, which i think was jobs which was much more important to me. but i wanted to get on -- stop, rather than saying nose or ears, that's common. coming from eyes, nose, ears.
what it means is, a person is angry. very angry. she was very angry. i didn't want to finish the statement, and i stopped the statement short. i mean, i didn't even say anything. >> you explained what you meant to say there. that's not what you said. many people took it another way. i want to get into your relationship with women. >> george, they should not have taken it another way. they shouldn't have. >> you mentioned all the women you hired in your businesses. but those comments that megyn kelly talked about, they did check out. we went back and looked at them. there were also from your best-seller, the art of the comeback, women have one of the acts of all time. the smart ones act very feminine and needy but inside they are real killers. real killers, what did you mean by that? >> i say that with great respect. women are tremendous. i find women -- i have had such an amazing relationship with women in business, they are amazing executives, they are killers. when i say that about a man, it's very sad. if you say that about a man, it's considered a great honor.
it's also a great honor when you say that about a woman. and that's the way it was meant. they are phenomenal. i have many executives that are women, they're doing a phenomenal job. i pay them a tremendous amount of money, they make money from me, they make money for themselves and in many cases they truly are really talented and they can be killers. you know what that statement means. as a man they love that statement and women love it also. part of the problem -- george, part of the problem we have in this country, we're trying to be so politically correct that nobody can say anything anymore. and it's a disgrace. >> but that's the country you're trying to become president of right now and there is this impression out there, that you have this history of misogynist statements. that are you anti-women. you are responding to it right now. but you have people like the chair of the republican party saying you're a chauvinist. how are you going to combat that impression, is it a problem for you? >> i don't think so at all, george. in the meantime, i'm doing well in the polls with women. i have hired women -- i have thousands working for me right now, they're doing phenomenally well at top levels.
i'm doing great in the polls. you know, speaking about new hampshire, i'm leading new hampshire, i'm leading iowa, i'm leading north carolina and south carolina. i'm leading -- and when i say leading, by big numbers leading. by very big. the numbers just came in from georgia, i'm leading georgia by phenomenal, big numbers. and i'm leading in every national polls. and in some cases by double digits. those are women voters largely and i'm doing very well with the women voters. >> some other questions from conservatives, about whether they'll still support you after your entire record is known, jon karl talked about your support for single-payer health care, your support for that in the past. back in 1999, you went on "good morning america," you also wrote in your book, calling for a 14.2% wealth tax. take a look. >> this would be a one-time tax, 14.25% against people with a net worth of over $10 million or more. it would pay off in its entirety
the national debt of $5.7 trillion. you'd save $200 million a year. >> you now say you're against that, but why were you for it then? why are you against it now? >> at the time, i was willing to do it, i was wealthy even then. that was a long time ago. i was willing to do it. it was a suggestion. i would have loved to have seen the national debt be paid off. we're going to soon be over 20 trillion. we are 18, close to 19 now. we're going to be over $20 trillion. we should have paid off the national debt one way or another. >> let me ask you about that. >> we have to do something. >> let me ask you about that. >> i was willing to do it. >> i get that. you were for it. you were not for it now. how can conservatives trust that you're not going to change again? >> well, look, ronald reagan was a democrat. in fact, he was on the liberal side of being a democrat and he changed.
and he did a very good job. and he liked me and i liked him a lot. i worked with him. he was a terrific guy, but he was a democrat and, george, he was sort of a liberal democrat and he changed. and i have evolved. and i have evolved very strongly. i'm a conservative. i have tremendous support. but i also have a lot of support among democrats. when you do your polls, if you look at your polls, i have support from all over the place and people are actually shocked by it. >> and mr. trump you have -- >> i'm leading in every poll. >> you have supported democrats more recently, back in 2006, you and your son gave $77,000 to democrats, that was the election that brought nancy pelosi to power, brought harry reid to power, they have since passed president obama's agenda, conservatives are against that. so, how can conservatives trust you? when you recently gave so much money to their opponents. >> because, george, i made a net worth, i have net worth of over $10 billion, i have been a world-class businessman, which is by the way what this country needs to make good trade deals. we're being ripped off by china and japan.
and mexico and everybody else. so i was a businessman. i was a business person and i supported everybody. because as a businessperson you had to. when i needed something people were always there for me. if i supported somebody and three years later i needed something, they were always there for me. and by the way, george, that's what's wrong with the system, the lobbyists, the donors. all of these -- >> that's exactly what i wanted to get it. >> these people control everything. >> that's exactly the question i want to get to. it came in from twitter. you've essentially confessed to bribing politicians, would you fix this or perpetuate it? you've been a part of the problem, how are you going to be a part of the solution? >> no, i'm not -- i understand the system better than anybody. because i was part of the system. i would support a lot of people, until two months ago, when i announced that i'm going to run for president and make our country great again, which is what i'm going to do, and people see it, but i understand the system better than anybody,
but they come and they see you. look at jeb bush, he's raised $100 million, i guess, by the way, many of the people putting up that money are friends of mine. these are not people that are putting it up because they want the color of his hair. they are people who want something and they're going to get something, and with me i don't want anybody's money, i can actually straighten out the country without having people come, special interests and everything else come and say, no, no, no, you can't do that because so and so supported you. that's one of the reasons i'm killing everyone in the polls. >> it's clear you're not backing down. full speed ahead on the campaign. you'll be in the next debate? >> we're doing fantastically well with the campaign, the numbers are incredible. you know that better than anybody because you report them. and no, it's full speed ahead. i'm having a good time. i really love it. >> donald trump, thank you for your time. >> thank you very much, george. and we're joined now by another candidate who broke through on thursday night, governor john kasich of ohio. thanks for joining us this morning, governor. you just heard donald trump is full speed ahead, is that a
problem for your party? >> george, i don't think about things that way. you know what happened on thursday, i was relaxed and i was able to talk about my record, balancing the federal budget. one of the chief architects, national security experience. turning ohio around. george, i don't really pay any attention to these other things, because it's most important for me to be able to tell people who i am and, you know, i'm kind of a positive guy, i want to lift people, i want everyone to be included once we create economic growth. i want everyone to share in it. and look, i enjoyed myself on thursday night and i'm enjoying being on the campaign trail. >> so, you don't agree with lindsey graham. who said the republican party has crossed the rubicon where trump's behavior is becoming about republicans not about him? >> well, george, if i'm the nominee, and you have known me for a long time, i'm going to have a positive message of inclusion, economic growth, strong national defense, that's
the way i have always been. i have been in politics for a long time. i have run in i don't know how many elections. many of them. and i have always been on the positive side of things. i feel like, you know, frankly i can help to shape this party, you know i talked about economic growth not being an end to of itself and a need to reach out to people who live in the shadows. and when you pay attention to what's being said in many corners of the republican party people are beginning to talk about that. i consider that to be great progress. because we want to make sure that the miracle we call america is people can be a part of it. >> you tried to express that on thursday night. lot of democrats were watching the debate and thought that the whole party was creating problems with women's voters. a big story about that in "the new york times." it included this quote from margaret hoover, republican strategist. who said, not one candidate attempted to persuade women voters. there's a difference between pandering and vote-courting. thursday night, gop candidates did neither for women weary of
the republican brand. your response? >> look, george, i can just tell you what i'm hearing. you know, in some ways i feel like a astronaut who just went up in a capsule who just splashed down out of the capsule and put me on the deck of an aircraft carrier. all of a sudden people took my picture. and for someone who has had a record, people are beginning to know who i am. look, everywhere i'm going people are slapping me on the back, saying you did a great job. you're not attacking other people. to me, george, i always felt the republican party needed to be more for things than against things. because it's ideas, it's innovation that drives excitement and that drives support. if you spend your time worrying about somebody else, being negative, then you're not breathing life and energy into what you're doing. >> you hope that's going to be successful for you. you're going to be the nominee, but thursday night, you pledged to support the republican
nominee no matter what, does that stand even if it's donald trump? >> i'm a republican. whoever the nominee is i'm going to get behind him. plain and simple. by the way, i'm not thinking about running as an independent. it's hard enough to run as a republican, you know. >> one of the other hurdles is going to be the conservatives. you weren't at the red state event we just saw governor bush at over the week. erick erickson who organized it, he said this, i will not vote for president in 2016 if god and republicans decide to punish us with john kasich as the presidential nominee or vice presidential nominee. not. gonna. happen. do you have a problem with conservatives because of your support for expanding medicare? common core openness to the path of citizenship? >> george, george, look, i was the chief architect of balancing the federal budget, we paid down the largest amount of publicly held debt. we cut taxes on risk-taking while i was in washington.
i was very involved in welfare reform. i want to reform the pentagon while building a strong defense, in ohio, we went from $8 billion in the hole to $2 billion in the black in our budget. we're up 350,000 jobs. i have cut taxes more than any standing governor by 5 billion, including killing the death tax. our credit has risen. but, because i think that people who live in the shadows, who have been ignored, the mentally ill who we stick in prison, they don't belong in prison. the drug addicted who we're rehabbing in ohio, you know, we rehab them, the resitvism rate is 10% in ohio. the working poor, we want to help them. but it's like my mother used to say, it's a sin not to help people who need help. but it's equally a sin to help people who need to learn how to help themselves. so, i think that's -- i mean, i don't know what's more conservative than that or has a better record. but i do care about people. thank god that it's been placed in my soul.
i'll continue to do it whether i win or not. >> it looks like you have a lot of confidence this morning. you're full speed ahead as well. governor kasich, thank you for joining us this morning. much more to come. mike huckabee and rick perry are live. our roundtable breaks down the big debate, the trump fallout, who else won? who lost? did it help or hurt the gop? later this week, marked the 50th anniversary of the voter rights act. senator cory booker weighs in where it stands today. rge stephanopoulos brought to >> announcer: "this week" with george stephanopoulos brought to you by sap. a knack for predicting the future. reflexes faster than the speed of thought. can a business have a spirit? can a business have a soul? can a business be...alive?
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most watched ever by a mile, 24 million people tuned in to watch those ten candidates right there, donald trump of course dominated the headlines. let's talk about that, joined by mark halperin, john heilemann. our own donna brazile. sara fagen. republican strategist and cnbc contributor. matthew dowd, everyone tuned into that. donald trump every headline since that debate. three weeks he attacks john mccain on his war record, lot of predictions he's going fall, he doesn't. you heard him this morning, full speed ahead. is he deluding himself or right? >> donald trump as we have discovered is very unshamable, he can't be shamed during this. i'm sorry doesn't seem to be a part of his lexicon. i think, donald trump represents a whole group of voters who are disaffected from both parties. who are sick and tired of the washington establishment. for me, there are three things about this that donald trump represents, a blending of entertainment and political news that we arrived at where selfie replaces seriousness. two, the idea we have a
dom bombastic, belligerent culture that exists in politics today. he seems to represent that. three, more importantly, i have total confidence in voters who always do this in the course of this, they'll sort through this, they'll figure it out, and in the end, both parties will nominate a competent person to be president. >> you're nodding your head, sara. you have seen more republicans willing to come out him. >> they're willing to call him out. this just feels like that summer fling in high school your parents tell you not to do and you can't help yourself. but by the time we get back to school, i think donald is going to be fading well into the background of this race. and what was great about that debate was there were really strong candidates on that stage. the governors i thought particularly did well. marco rubio did well. and any number of them are going to take on hillary clinton and 24 million people were exposed to them. >> we do want to talk about the overall debate in a minute. let's stick to trump for a minute. mark halperin, you heard him this morning, no apologies whatsoever, talked about his
great record with women, pushing forward on the campaign, how do you think he pivots off of this? >> my sources say that he's going to try to pivot to what his strength is, he'll start talking about jobs, economy and trade. his campaign is more professional than people realize, they're do more of the things of organizing, gathering names, thinking about advertising strategy. going forward the establishment the other candidates, the press, kind of an triangle says trump is dead, this is the beginning of the end. the people he's bringing in, i don't think he's going to go up necessarily after the debate. but i don't think he is going to go down. >> john, has he now established a ceiling? he has walled off a lot of latino voters. walled off women. what is his ceiling? >> george, new hampshire, a couple of weeks ago i did a focus group. i gave them a lot of negative information about trump, to see if they knew single-payer health care, donations to democrats. all of that stuff, and they didn't care.
they were not moved off their enthusiasm for trump. in fact, they kept rationalizing him. people really like him. i think that there's a chance that 20% may be his ceiling but it may also his floor. which is to say, it's going to be hard for him to go much past that. they may stick with him in the long haul. in a race with 16, 17 candidates, 20% is enough to make a lot of trouble in iowa, new hampshire. >> and donna, democrats enjoying watching this. but is it a trap if donald trump hangs out and gives the other candidates a chance to development over the course of the summer fling. >> i also think that those other candidates should be happy that donald trump is occupying so much space, because, i think what i saw on thursday, many of them don't have foreign positions, they have a lot of sound bites, but not a lot of foreign positions, we didn't get to hear that. i think is beyond politics, this is about common decency and mr. trump attacked not just on megyn kelly but other women, that will
have a cumulative effect not only on mr. trump but the republican brand. >> i don't necessarily agree with that. i thought the governors were very substantive. jeb bush, chris christie. over john kasich was sub and you're right, as this campaign unfolds there's going to be more substance to this race and republicans should feel very good about the breadth of their talent right now. >> george, i think the biggest mistake the republicans made on that stage, someone should have stood up and took him on the women's issues at the debate. this shouldn't be, oh, don't attack megyn kelly. this is be about don't attack rosie o'donnell, don't attack michelle obama. don't attack wendy davis in texas, this is not defend your friends, somebody should have stood up and not waited two days later and say donald trump should have done that. on that stage, a traditional value of republicans and people should be respecting women. >> george, i heard it that night, when he said to megyn kelly, essentially, wait a
minute, i treated you nice. he acted like, hey, if you don't be a nice girl, i'm going to get really mad at you. that is missogeny. he was like, if you're not a nice girl i'm going to get mad at you. >> there are two scenarios. it doesn't make it misogyny. >> i doesn't make it any better. >> there are two scenarios, trump is a factor through iowa or trump is disappear. what i think is the real story now in the second scenario, most people think who's prepared for that moment, who's prepared for the scrutiny that will come? who's prepared to have a message and step up and get some of trump's vote? >> thank you very much for setting it up. coming up, who else won and who else lost? how they think of it in hillary clinton's camp. all that, plus mike huckabee and rick perry and how they're going to handle donald trump now. >> announcer: "this week" with george stephanopoulos brought to you by hp.
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the wrong is one which no american in his heart can justify. the right is one which no american true to our principles can deny. >> historic moment 50 years ago, lyndon johnson signing the voting rights act. senator cory booker of new jersey, saying that's under threat right now. thank you for joining us this morning. we have argued the combination of the supreme court's decision back in 2013 which overthrew a key portion of the voting rights act. efforts to pass voter rights laws. my question is what is the solution? some like martin o'malley say you need a constitutional amendment guaranteeing the right to vote. >> first, i want to press the case. many people don't understand that this voting rights act is under threat.
these voters i.d. laws which are being passed in many states have a disproportionate impact. >> what's the harm in making sure there is no harm at the voting booth? >> that's the point. there is no harm. take texas for example, where lyndon johnson is from, they passed these voter i.d. laws. in the decade before that, ten years, they only prosecuted two people. you're more likely to get struck by lightning in texas than so find voter fraud. but yet they passed a law that even right now we saw the circuit court said there are 600,000 people being affected by this. di disproportionately minority, and poor. when you see all of these voter restrictions taking advantage of the loopholes that were opened up by the act, the lack of preclearance necessary, you suddenly see people racing to
put in laws that really are, as we see, a solution that has no problem, in fact it's creating the problem. >> if it is, do you need a constitutional amendment? >> i have joined with dick durbin, senator leahy, in a step before that. i don't think necessarily you need a constitutional amendment. i think there are things we can do legislatively to address that. there has to be some kind of a halt done that deny people voting rights. i want to take it a step further. for me, right now, i look at the voting rights act, born not from the pen of lyndon johnson. before the ink was dried, it was sweat, blood and effort of many people to expand voting access to americans. what we have also seen in this country since the 1970s is a great restriction of voters rights in this country. what i mean specifically by that in 1976, about 1.7 million americans were denied their voting rights because of previous convictions. they had felony disenfranchisement. since the 1970s, we had this explosion of this drug war,
incredible explosion of massive incarceration in this country, disproportionately affecting minorities. and now we have come to a point in america, in 2010, we had 5.85 million americans who have lost their voting rights because of previous convictions, they paid their debt to society, many of them nonviolent criminals, if that was a state, it would be 20th biggest state in our nation. >> that is just one issue that is getting a lot of attention right now. we have seen the rise of the black lives matter movement over the last year as well, it's gaining some steam. there was a moment last night, bernie sanders was out in seattle, where he was trying to speak, he was talked down by members of the black lives matter protest. >> we will fight for black lives no matter what it takes. >> is he getting fair treatment there and what more should be done to address this issue?
>> well, two things. first of all, bernie sanders is a friend and a colleague. i'm supporting hillary clinton in this election, but bernie has become somebody i have tremendous respect for, as an ally of mine addressing issues in the united states senate that affect minority communities. he has a long record of civil rights. but the anger you saw there, from the protesters, this is a legitimate degree of frustration in this country, in a nation that has yet to confront what i believe are persistent human rights issues. you mentioned in the criminal justice system, yeah, we know that we see, there are some statements that one in five black americans don't have a right to vote because of this mass felony disenfranchisement. but that's just one thing. we have an overall prison system where we see there's no difference between black and whites. between minorities and whites in
using drugs. and in dealing drugs. some studies show that young whites have more of a chance of being drug dealers. but yet we have an incarceration rate for drugs, drug use and drug selling that's disproportionately seen. in commune tips of color. and the result ofs that has created awful realities in america. we have more african-americans under super vision than all the 1850s. we have a nation that has states like mine that has 14%, 15% african-americans, but the prison population is over 60% black. and so, when you know there's no difference, when you're african-american almost four times for likely to be caught for the use of marijuana than if you are white. when you see a justice system that is not like what is etched in the wall. equal justice under the law. please understand that there's going to be an understandable reaction to that in our country. the criminal justice is so overbroad right now that, we as a nation is spending quarter of a trillion dollars a year, we
are 4 to 5% of the population. have one out of every four prison person in this country. yeah, there's a reason to be upset. >> senator cory booker, thank you very much. next up, gop candidates mike huckabee and rick perry both here live. more analysis from our powerhouse roundtable. and that other big moment in politics this week, jon stewart's final show. >> rather than saying good-bye or good night, i'm just going to say i'm going to go get a drink.
it seems like this election has been a whole lot about a person who's very high in the polls but doesn't have a clue about how to govern, a person who has been filled with scandals and who could not lead and of course i'm talking about hillary clinton. >> a little misdirection there from governor mike huckabee, former governor of arkansas. presidential candidate. thursday night's debate. governor huckabee, thank you for joining us this morning. so, you had a nice turn at the end of that debate on thursday night. but donald trump hasn't backed down at all since that debate. what do you say about him now? >> look, he is connecting with a lot of people, but i think the rest of us are doing what we're supposed to do and that's focus on getting a message out, which is sometimes hard to do because all of the air in the balloon is going to donald trump right now, but that's okay, because this is a long process, and it's a like
a baseball season, george. there are some early games, doesn't necessarily determine who's going be in the world series, and when we go to a debate, quite frankly, there wasn't a lot of substance, it's hard to do a lot of substance when you're given one minute or 30 seconds. so, i would love to have an opportunity on that stage to go into details why i defend social security and medicare. why i believe in fair tax. all people want to ask me is about donald trump. >> but at what point does that become a real problem for your party and do you have to stand up and do the other candidates have to stand up and say, enough is enough, he's not going to be our nominee, we will not support him if he is? >> i don't think that's our role, i think our role is to run for president. it's the voters' role to determine who they're going to connect to, my job is to connect to the voters, not to disconnect them from donald trump, he's going to give his message. i'm going to give mine. and in time, we'll see which one
really speaks to the heart, the soul and the sense of option and opportunity for the american people. i think in the long term, when i get a chance to talk with people how do we bring wages up, 90% of people in this country, wages have been flat for 40 years. there's some real hurt out there in america. people are hurt so much, they are angry and donald trump is touching that. now people are going to start to say, over the coming months, how do we fix this? how do we make it better? some of us have thought through this quite a bit. we have been through this process of not only running for president but of governing. and that's when the race is going to get even more serious. >> i agree with you. there was a lot of substance in the debate.
one of the issues that all the candidates agreed with was defunding planned parenthood. you went further on thursday night. i want to show that right here. >> i think it's time to do something even more bold, i think the next president ought to invoke the fifth and 14th amendments to the constitution, now that we clearly know that that baby inside a woman's womb is a person at the moment of conception. >> there was a recent headline when you spoke back in kansas, topeka capital journal, where the headline said mike huckabee, republican presidential candidate won't rule out employing u.s. troops, fbi to stop abortion, is that the fallout from invoking the fifth and 14th amendments? >> the whole idea about the troops and the fbi didn't come from me. those weren't my words. that was something that the "rolling stone" reporter said, and we know how reliable "rolling stone" is as a journalistic tool. so, what i'm saying is, the real issue here is not are we going to give money to planned parenthood.
yes, that is important. the bigger issue is, is that unborn child is a human being, because if it is, then the fifth and 14th amendment apply. >> what does that mean, though, in practice? >> it means that you guarantee due process under the fifth amendment. before you deprive someone of their life and liberty. it means under the 14th amendment there's equal protection under the law. exactly how that plays out is one of the ways we discover, what does it take for americans to finally wake up to the fact that we're violating the constitutional rights of human beings. in the past, presidents have employed many different ways to make sure that people's basic human rights are protected. >> but would that mean calling in law enforcement to prevent abortions? >> i think the bigger question is, let's establish the personhood of the individual, let's make sure that america comes to grips with that. george, we can't keep defending the loss of 60 million human lives over the past 42 years, we're not acting like a civilized people in the way in
which abortion in its unrestricted fashion has continued. even the politicians who pretend they're not really for it, they're personally against it. they'll say things like let's keep it safe, legal and rare. it's not safe. i don't think it's legal. i think it violates the fifth and 14th amendment rights of an unborn person. and it certainly isn't rare. it happens 4,000 times a day. that's hardly rare. >> governor huckabee, thank you for joining us. hope you'll come back soon. rick perry joins us now, former governor of texas, also presidential candidate. he was there on thursday night, in the early debate, joins us from iowa. we just heard from governor huckabee what do you think of invoking the fifth and 14th amendments to protect the right to life? >> i think that anyone who has seened videos of planned parent hd is offended.
whether they are on the fence about protecting life. that's what we need to be focused on these operations that are clearly outside the bounds of not just humanity, outside the bounds of our criminal law. one of the reasons we shut down planned parenthood in texas and i might add, replaced those dollars with women's health care dollars that really went to the core and didn't protect what the people of state of texas wanted to do which is not be a place that expanded abortion, we had parental consent notification and we also had laws that sonogram bills and others to protect the life and also to protect the life of those mothers. the real issue is to give real options on women's health care and to restrict these groups that are using out of the norm procedures to do these abortions.
>> you know, you held your own in that first debate on thursday, but it had about a quarter of the viewers of the primetime debate on fox news, what is going to take to get you into the second debate? and can you run an effective campaign if you're not? >> this is a long game. george, it's six months until iowa. that's the reason i'm in iowa now. it's going to be iowa, new hampshire and south carolina that puts our nominee on track. that's one of the things i learned in 2011, you got to spend a lot of time in iowa, new hampshire and south carolina. debates are important. but there is nothing that's more important than sitting in a town hall meeting or in a roping arena as i was last night in iowa falls, iowa, talking to the people. they're the ones that are going to show up for the caucus and the primaries in new hampshire and south carolina, that's where you better be spending your time. >> so, you're in for the first votes even if you don't get into
the debates? >> well, sure, we're going to be engaged in this process and it's going to be a fluid up and down, back and forth. it always is. what i try to remind people, back in '07, rudy giuliani led the polls for almost a year, he and fred thompson, there was some celebrity going on there. and we may be seeing a bit of that right now, so i think this is a very fluid process and it's going to change a lot. i feel confident they're interested in who has the executive experience, who's created jobs, i'm one of the few who have worn the uniform of the country. and who the solution-oriented candidates are going to be. >> in the meantime, you have to contend with donald trump, you skauled him a cancer of conservativism. you've called him out fairly early, has he finally gone too far? do you think he is going to collapse?
>> we'll see about that. that's frankly up to him. any time a candidate, i don't care who it is, having been the governor of texas and had very close relationship with our men and women in uniform, as a matter of fact, marcus latrell came and lived with my wife and i for almost two years. a young man who was captured by the taliban. and what donald trump said about him and others who have served our country so nobly was really offensive to me. so, i'm not going to be quiet. i'm going to call out mr. trump or anyone else for offending young people giving up their lives for us, it's not a political game with me. so, i'm going to be very strong when it comes. i'm going to speak out loudly when anyone offends those men and women who are doing everything that they can to keep us free in in country. >> thanks for being on the program. thanks for joining us this morning. >> thank you. the roundtable back with more on that epic debate and jon stewart's farewell after this
i'll never forget you, jon, i'll never forget you, jon, but i will be trying. >> good riddance, smartass. >> don't go, come back. jon, i'm being sarcastic. >> and just when i'm running for president, what a bummer. >> what has 9 1/2 fingers and won't miss you at all? this guy. >> i'm sure you'll be missed by somebody. >> there are a lot of things happening around the world that keep me up at night which is why i have relied on you to put me to sleep. >> i'm jon stewart, i'm dumb, i'm stupid. nah, nah. so long. >> a little payback for jon stewart's final show. the other big show on thursday night. i'm back now with the roundtable. we'll talk about that in a minute. i want to stick on the debate, mark. we heard sara fagen said that some of the governors did well. what is your analysis?
the other winners here? it did seen like marco rubio, john kasich did well. scott walker and 1yed jeb bush middling. >> there are a lot of debates to go and i think, you know, jeb bush needs to do better than that if he is going to be a nominee. i don't think his supporters think he did that well. he was much better at red state yesterday. none of these guys, guys on the ten-person debate, are rising so far to the occasion, but it is the summer. and i think all of them left there having learned even the people who got the best reviews are strong enough to win the general election. but there is still time. >> we did see carly in that undercard do quite well in the first debate, i want to take a bit of issue with the idea the summer debates, lot of time, of course there's a lot of time left, but there's no fact the debates this time around do have the equivalent of the straw polls used to be even with the early primaries. >> republican party restricting the number of debates, having one per month. there aren't many big debates
between now and when the first votes are cast in iowa. so i think that all matter a lot. that audience the other night was enormous. so, i think it matters a lot. i think carly fiorina was the one person who broke through the undercard. i can't imagine how one way or another she won't be on that main stage. >> if the polling numbers -- >> i just cannot see how they can get the one woman in the race up there on that stage. especially with the dynamic that plaped out in the last debate. >> do you agree with that? >> well, i think she's earned the right to be there. but at the same time, you can't have a debate with 15 people on the stage, it simply just isn't going to work. so there has to be a criteria -- >> what do they do if she's still at 1%, 2%? >> she's not. in the aftermath -- first of all, she had an audience of 6 million people for an undercard debate. i think the fourth largest under card debate -- and the play she got in three days after -- after trump, she got the most play.
in the entire conversation after that. i think she makes that average. she's in the top ten. the person most likely to drop out of the top ten, is chris christie. who was the leading candidate a year and a half ago. >> despite that exchange with rand paul? >> but he was strong. i thought christie was quite strong. >> in the aftermath that hasn't been forgotten. 3.5%. >> a fair point. in the aftermath of this debate, everything has been forgotten. because the only thing people are talking about is donald trump. here's to me what is the bigger concern about trump, if you look at the way the delegate process works you need over a 1,000 delegates to win. the nomination. the first 15 days from february 1 through march 15th, we are going to decide 45% of our delegates proportionally. if we continue to see the noise in this system, and all of these delegates are decided proportionally, this is going to be a long debate. >> most of those delegates will
be chosen during the process on march 1st. >> he's got money, too. >> he has -- that's right. that's why -- ted cruz, in terms of his organization and his ability to break through. >> jeb bush has money. ted cruz. is strong. >> they both have money and the only two really focused on a 35-state strategy going forward. >> money -- i'm going to speak a little heresy, money isn't going to matter in this race, right? as you go along in the process, momentum matters. whoever gains momentum -- >> what if you have split winners? scott walker wins iowa, jeb bush wins new hampshire -- marco rubio wins south carolina. >> i think the longer it goes where you have a large candidate field, the more other candidates are helped in that process. the longer this goes, i agree with that. one thing, we talked about all of this and how it's going to hurt the gop, and all that, if a republican emerges from this process, who is thoughtful, who is reasonable conservative, who
is expansive in how they approach the country that's going to give hillary clinton if she's the nominee a run for her money. here is somebody who's not liked by the country. who is distrusted by the country and who the current incumbent president -- >> donna, let me bring that to you. last night, bernie sanders we saw him get spoken down in seattle, right after that event, 15,000 people in seattle. there's a lot of energy. >> he's gone to portland, oakland, and bernie sanders is really hot, he's hot right now, hot in terms of the passion of the democratic party, the passion of independents. i want to go back to what matt said about hillary clinton, her numbers, she have suffered since announcing her race, look at her favorability. compare it to some of the republicans who had a lot of air time. i'm not concerned about hillary clinton right now because i know she has an opportunity to regain all of that momentum once we start our debate season in october. >> john heilemann, 15 seconds. >> you can't look at the enthusiasm of bernie sanders and not be worried if you're the clinton campaign.
you can't look at her internal numbers on honest and trust worthy. he could beat her in iowa, he could beat her in new hampshire. >> then hit a firewall. he can't beat her in the long haul. >> you know what, that's all we have time for today. thank you all. thank you for sharing part of your sunday with us. check out "world news tonight." come right back tomorrow for "good morning america." "good morning america."